Is Ivan McKee in control of Scotland's public sector reform?

But after I sat down with McKee to discuss public sector reform – arguably the biggest task in government – I left with concerns.

Being tasked with overhauling Scotland’s bloated public sector is not a job many politicians would volunteer for. In many ways, it is a poisoned chalice. Slimming down the state ultimately requires cuts and no matter what he does, there will be people unhappy with the outcome.

McKee clearly understands the need to reduce bureaucracy, cut unnecessary management layers and deliver better value for taxpayers. I believed him when he said he was determined to achieve that.

What was less convincing was whether the Cabinet Secretary is the person driving the difficult decisions required to make those ambitions a reality.

Ivan McKee was appointed Cabinet Secretary for Public Service Reform in May. (Image: Jane Barlow/PA Wire)

Before and during the interview, there was the impression that McKee would rather be somewhere else. Many readers may sympathise with that feeling about spending time with a journalist.

But again and again, when discussion moved from the principles of reform to the practical decisions required to deliver it, McKee appeared either unwilling or unable to provide detail.

On hybrid working, he quickly distanced himself from operational responsibility and pointed towards the Permanent Secretary Joe Griffin. It is, of course, true that Griffin runs the civil service. But shouldn’t the man responsible for overhauling it not know more about where civil servants are working, whether attendance expectations are being met and how effectively the government's vast estate is being used?

Asked whether attendance expectations were actually being met, he did not offer a clear answer. Asked about compromises reached with trade unions, he declined to explain them. Asked whether ministers would ultimately enforce their own policy if unions objected, he never produced a definitive response.

Ministers are entitled to keep some negotiating positions private. No sensible observer expects live discussions with trade unions to be conducted through newspaper interviews. But there is a difference between declining to discuss negotiations and struggling to project authority over them.

What was striking was not that McKee refused to answer certain questions. It was that he rarely sounded like the person making the final call.

For someone charged with leading one of the government's biggest reform agendas, there were surprisingly few moments where he projected ownership of the most difficult decisions.

The language was often passive. Conversations were ongoing. Processes were under way. Positions were clear. Others were responsible.

Perhaps the most revealing moment came when he sought to defend hybrid working.

"I think anybody that's working in the modern world, yourself included, myself included, everybody works hybrid," he said.

Inside government offices, that may sound entirely uncontroversial. Outside them, it sounds detached from reality.

Many Herald readers do not work hybrid. Nurses do not work hybrid. Care home staff do not work hybrid. Refuse workers, prison officers, firefighters, bus drivers and countless others whose jobs require them to be physically present every day do not work hybrid. Nor do many private sector workers.

One of the reasons hybrid working provokes such strong feelings is precisely because many people feel there are different rules for different groups of workers.

Someone getting up before dawn for a shift in a hospital or care home may hear a minister claim "everybody works hybrid" and conclude that government simply does not understand their reality.

Perhaps it was an off-the-cuff remark. But it spoke to a wider challenge facing the reform agenda.

Public service reform ultimately requires public trust. To build that trust, ministers need to demonstrate that they understand why people are frustrated about waste and inefficiency.

The debate can no longer be about identifying the problems. Ministers have been told about them for years.

The challenge now is implementation.

That requires a minister who not only understands the destination but convinces people he is in control of the journey.

I began the interview believing McKee might be that person. I left less certain. The vision was clear enough. What was less clear was whether the Cabinet Secretary himself is the man in the know when the most consequential decisions are being made.

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